tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post4693908777861224631..comments2024-03-23T05:55:29.759-04:00Comments on Bonsai from the Right: Today Congress Votes To Do More Fundamental Change To Our CountryChrishttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12905362327313044045noreply@blogger.comBlogger34125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-76579663880196686262010-05-01T15:20:53.282-04:002010-05-01T15:20:53.282-04:00Thanks Joe. Sorry I was a little sensitive.Thanks Joe. Sorry I was a little sensitive.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-54160350032158506612010-05-01T14:29:53.000-04:002010-05-01T14:29:53.000-04:00John i addressed it to you because i found it inte...John i addressed it to you because i found it interesting and thought you would too. No hidden agendas. I know you have a much more widely read group of sources than many of the usaul suspects here and thought you would be interested in it just for the hypothetical discussion.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-43298832118862557542010-05-01T12:19:24.302-04:002010-05-01T12:19:24.302-04:00Not sure why the birther thing was directed at me ...Not sure why the birther thing was directed at me Joe. As far as I know, McCain's parents are citizens of the US, so their child would be considered a natural born citizen? I never really got into the Obama birther thing; I am guessing that people's issues with Obama is that his mother renounced her citizenship or something? I don't really know. Again, it's interesting in theory I guess but as far as I am aware, any child born to citizens of the US are automatically citizens, isn't that right?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-9931266811810018612010-04-30T20:19:19.292-04:002010-04-30T20:19:19.292-04:00john, while looking up the insular cases and their...john, while looking up the insular cases and their application to Puerto Rican citizens i found an interesting link. <br /><br />http://www.usconstitution.net/consttop_citi.html<br /><br />has all the basic run of the mill stuff until i found this...<br /><br />The law contains one other section of historical note, concerning the Panama Canal Zone and the nation of Panama. In 8 USC 1403, the law states that anyone born in the Canal Zone or in Panama itself, on or after February 26, 1904, to a mother and/or father who is a United States citizen, was "declared" to be a United States citizen. Note that the terms "natural-born" or "citizen at birth" are missing from this section.<br /><br />In 2008, when Arizona Senator John McCain ran for president on the Republican ticket, some theorized that because McCain was born in the Canal Zone, he was not actually qualified to be president. However, it should be noted that section 1403 was written to apply to a small group of people to whom section 1401 did not apply. McCain is a natural-born citizen under 8 USC 1401(c): "a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents both of whom are citizens of the United States and one of whom has had a residence in the United States or one of its outlying possessions, prior to the birth of such person." Not everyone agrees that this section includes McCain — but absent a court ruling either way, we must presume citizenship.<br /><br />it included a link to this paper...<br />http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract-id=1157621#<br /><br />Why Senator John McCain Cannot Be President: Eleven Months and a Hundred Yards Short of Citizenship <br /><br />Abstract: <br />Senator McCain was born in 1936 in the Canal Zone to U.S. citizen parents. The Canal Zone was territory controlled by the United States, but it was not incorporated into the Union. As requested by Senator McCain's campaign, distinguished constitutional lawyers Laurence Tribe and Theodore Olson examined the law and issued a detailed opinion offering two reasons that Senator McCain was a natural born citizen. Neither is sound under current law. The Tribe-Olson Opinion suggests that the Canal Zone, then under exclusive U.S. jurisdiction, may have been covered by the Fourteenth Amendment's grant of citizenship to "all persons born . . . in the United States." However, in the Insular Cases, the Supreme Court held that "unincorporated territories" were not part of the United States for constitutional purposes. Accordingly, many decisions hold that persons born in unincorporated territories are not Fourteenth Amendment citizens. The Tribe-Olson Opinion also suggests that Senator McCain obtained citizenship by statute. However, the only statute in effect in 1936 did not cover the Canal Zone. Recognizing the gap, in 1937, Congress passed a citizenship law applicable only to the Canal Zone, granting Senator McCain citizenship, but eleven months too late for him to be a citizen at birth. Because Senator John McCain was not a citizen at birth, he is not a "natural born Citizen" and thus is not "eligible to the Office of President" under the Constitution.<br /><br />This essay concludes by exploring how changes in constitutional law implied by the Tribe-Olson Opinion, such as limiting the Insular Cases and expanding judicial review of immigration and nationality laws passed by Congress, could make Senator McCain a citizen at birth and thus a natural born citizen.<br /><br /><br />I am assuming that he is in fact a citizen and that the federal election committee did its job unlike the birthers.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-40220107411142637712010-04-30T20:12:06.604-04:002010-04-30T20:12:06.604-04:00Chris, Puerto ricans are not subject to US income ...Chris, Puerto ricans are not subject to US income tax while living in Puerto Rico. The pay a governship tax or what ever they call it. they are subject to payroll taxes as we are but only receive social security not the SSI supplement. <br /><br />its also been suggested that medicaid and medicare pay less into Puerto Rico despite the citizens of the unincorporated territory paying the full tax amount, but i couldn't find adequate documentation. <br /><br /><br />John, you could suggest that, but that contradicts Chris's theory that this is being done as a revenue increase. I wouldn't disagree that the commonwealths income is low, but it matches the standard of living to some extent.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-36283967181522925552010-04-30T16:17:33.418-04:002010-04-30T16:17:33.418-04:00Joe they have to pay Puerto Rico "state"...Joe they have to pay Puerto Rico "state" tax and the Federal tax like all states have.Chrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12905362327313044045noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-83918362721049185872010-04-30T13:20:44.222-04:002010-04-30T13:20:44.222-04:00Joe said "they already pay more in income tax...Joe said "they already pay more in income taxes towards the Puerto Rican government than they would in Federal taxes."<br /><br />That is absolutely true Joe. Because their median income is so low they would not pay any Federal taxes for the most part, and would instead create a drain on entitlements and services. God forbid anyone pays for what they use, eh? LOLAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-14747774119182131732010-04-30T10:23:41.460-04:002010-04-30T10:23:41.460-04:00Chris, actually they are less free than us. Certai...Chris, actually they are less free than us. Certain aspects of the Constitution do not apply to them and they already pay more in income taxes towards the Puerto Rican government than they would in Federal taxes. <br /><br />I can agree that the is bill would change the political spectrum and the upcoming elections as the number of reps would stay the same and reaportionment would have to occur. none the less the fact remains that a serious group of people took a look at the issue in both 2005 and 2007 and issued a recommendation for these elections to take place. and consider that Bush 41 memorandum established the idea that continual plebiscites should occur to better serve the people of the commonwealth. <br /><br />As for the last referendum, do to langauge issue with the territorial aspect the citizens did not vote against statedhood, independence or even for continuing the commomnwealth they voted for none of the above. The 98 elections shouldn't be a means to deny a current one as nothing was decided.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-49324310408830856802010-04-30T08:16:55.398-04:002010-04-30T08:16:55.398-04:00Hey Joe Did Not Say You Were Wrong Just Said I Had...Hey Joe Did Not Say You Were Wrong Just Said I Had A Problem Reading It. Still Seems They Have Three Options Which To Me Does Split Vote and Could Make Minority Majority.ALnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-14065977421069195732010-04-30T07:54:22.332-04:002010-04-30T07:54:22.332-04:00Joe take a look at how Tennese became a state. Tha...Joe take a look at how Tennese became a state. That is how they are doing this to Puerto Rico. Why would the Puerto Ricans want to pay Federal taxes and be under the thumb of the fed? They are more free then us.Chrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12905362327313044045noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-63775953273666632782010-04-30T07:47:58.685-04:002010-04-30T07:47:58.685-04:00Joe this is a four step procces. It's the prog...Joe this is a four step procces. It's the progressive way. And the way this admin. works under the cover of darkness anything is posible. Just look at the stimulus bill that didn't work and the obamacare that sucks to high Heaven. Hell the Democrats took over the student loan business in a health care bill.They created a monopoly with a health care bill. No one seen that coming. Oh, the "neo cons" did.Chrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12905362327313044045noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-11433786155373726682010-04-30T07:33:08.119-04:002010-04-30T07:33:08.119-04:00Joe did you know that latinos were up in the air a...Joe did you know that latinos were up in the air as to what party they sided with? The Democrats and Republicans have been working to win that group over like the Democrats won the black vote. That is why we haven't made our borders safe under any president. Who wants to piss that group off? This is good for the government and not the Puerto Ricans. And that is why the Peurto Ricans voted it down 3X's. But this is a good debate. Thanks keep it up.Chrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12905362327313044045noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-83844442875475039552010-04-30T07:13:01.216-04:002010-04-30T07:13:01.216-04:00W ell Joe all the Republicans are waking up to wha...W ell Joe all the Republicans are waking up to what the Democrats are trying to do with this bill. They are changing their stories as well. And Joe it is politics as usual for the Democratic party. I did mean that. See Joe the Democrats are throwing out the race bait so they can call Republicans racist. It's their MO. And that is how they plan on fighting this Nov. And the Republicans that gave their first responce were just trying to not get cought in the Democrats race baiting trap. Thats politics as usual.Chrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12905362327313044045noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-26260325054998702312010-04-30T04:09:46.768-04:002010-04-30T04:09:46.768-04:00Al, you tell me i don't debate the issue and t...Al, you tell me i don't debate the issue and then when i do present solid information on why the issue is not what is being made up to be, you don't seem to read it. lolAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-29140611715334784402010-04-29T22:08:51.140-04:002010-04-29T22:08:51.140-04:00Joe If They Vote On Becoming a State And That Pass...Joe If They Vote On Becoming a State And That Passes What Union Are They Joining! Maybe My Ole Brain Aint Reading It Correctly.ALnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-790138988890508202010-04-29T21:38:38.316-04:002010-04-29T21:38:38.316-04:00they are not voting on whether or not they should ...they are not voting on whether or not they should enter our union Al. they are voting on which one of three possibilities they prefer:<br /><br />stay a commonwealth<br />become a state<br />Become independent <br /><br />Its the way they have voted on this for almost 50 years. Its not some conspiracy by current politicians to get them Hispanics.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-84073203039245557302010-04-29T21:06:04.760-04:002010-04-29T21:06:04.760-04:00Multiple Choice Elections! Welcome To Politics I...Multiple Choice Elections! Welcome To Politics In The USSA! Puerto Rico Stand Back Grab Your Wallet And Run To The Forest. <br /><br /> Responsible Governing One Would Think Would Be a Up or Down Vote On State Hood No Matter What Group Of Politcans Think in This Country. You Know If Their Voting On Entering OUR Union The Vote Should Be Like ANY State Vote Held Here. UP or DOWN!ALnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-20551713806889108312010-04-29T20:59:54.904-04:002010-04-29T20:59:54.904-04:00So hows this all Obama and the Dems fault?
Can w...So hows this all Obama and the Dems fault? <br /><br />Can we set aside partisanship and the Glen Beck conspiracy syndrome and look at reality? It has been determined by more than one president and multiple task forces that these votes take place periodically. <br /><br />And given that the writer of the bill is from Puerto rico and that it has bipartisan support this isn't some sort of expansionism or empire building as Christopher put it, but responsible governing.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-15905187098579786102010-04-29T20:51:40.561-04:002010-04-29T20:51:40.561-04:00So i started looking at the issue of Puerto rico a...So i started looking at the issue of Puerto rico and the conspiracy theories going on here about it. I found some interesting stuff. The most interesting was the 2007 Presidents Task force on Puerto Rico. <br /><br />First the fact exists that its treated as a state by federal government.<br /><br />President George H.W. Bush issued a<br />Memorandum on November 30, 1992,<br />to heads of Executive Departments and<br />Agencies establishing the current administrative relationship between the Federal Government and the Commonwealth of<br />Puerto Rico. This memorandum directs all<br />Federal departments, agencies, and officials<br />to treat Puerto Rico administratively as if<br />it were a State insofar as doing so would<br />not disrupt Federal programs or operations.<br />President Bush’s memorandum remains in<br />effect until Federal legislation is enacted to<br />alter the status of Puerto Rico in accordance<br />with the freely expressed wishes of the<br />people of Puerto Rico. <br /><br />that it has voted in plurality before:<br />In 1993, a plurality of 48.6%<br />voted for the commonwealth status, while<br />46.3% favored statehood and 4.4% in<br /><br />And that the last election the majority voted for "none of the above" instead of any of the other choices. <br /><br />That the Task force appointed by President Bush recommended another vote in its 2005 "Some of the proposed bills would sanction a plebiscite similar to the one recommended in the2005 Task Force Report"<br /><br />And that the task force agreed that a two stage plebiscite would be the way to go:<br /><br />"The democratic will of the Puerto Rican<br />people is paramount for determining the<br />future status of the territory. To this end,<br />the 2005 Task Force Report recommended<br />a two-stage plebiscite to determine whether<br />the Puerto Rican people wish to retain the<br />status quo, and if not, which of the two<br />available options they prefer. The Task<br />Force concluded that such a process would<br />be the best way to ascertain the popular<br />will in a way that provides clear guidance<br />for future action by Congress."<br /><br />"The Task Force<br />continues to believe that the two-stage<br />plebiscite would provide clearer guidance<br />for Congress than other procedures in<br />which it is possible that none of the available options would win a majority of votes." <br /><br />And finally the George W Bush appointed Task Force issues its recommendations...<br /><br />The following are the recommendations<br />of the Task Force:<br />1. The Task Force reiterates its prior<br />recommendation that Congress provide for<br />a Federally sanctioned plebiscite as soon as<br />practicable in which the people of Puerto<br />Rico will be asked to state whether they<br />wish to maintain the current territorial<br />status or to pursue a constitutionally viable<br />path toward a permanent non-territorial<br />status. Congress should provide for this<br />plebiscite to occur on a date certain.<br /><br />2. The Task Force reiterates its prior<br />recommendation that if the people of<br />Puerto Rico elect to pursue a permanent<br />non-territorial status, Congress should<br />provide for an additional plebiscite to<br />allow the people of Puerto Rico to choose<br />between one of the permanent non-territorial<br />options permitted by the Constitution:<br />statehood or independence. Once the people of Puerto Rico have selected one<br />of the two options, we would encourage<br />Congress to begin a process of transition<br />consistent with that option.<br /><br />3. If the people elect to maintain Puerto<br />Rico’s current status, the Task Force recommends, consistent with the 1992<br />memorandum of President George H.W.<br />Bush, that a plebiscite occur periodically<br />as long as that status continues, to keep<br />Congress informed of the people’s wishes.<br /><br />http://www.primerahora.com/XStatic/primerahora/docs/espanol/whitehousestatusreport.pdfAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-69862323545549112010-04-29T20:27:07.004-04:002010-04-29T20:27:07.004-04:00Chris, you said,"This is just politics as usu...Chris, you said,"This is just politics as usual for the Democratic party."<br /><br />i posted that the democrats like Candice miller were for this. Now you change your story.<br /><br />John, i don't mind you stepping outside of partisanship at all. the problem is Chris, Christopher and others are blaming the dems. I pointed out that plenty of republicans are for this bill. 61 in fact. 61 you say? yes, the bill has 61 Republican co-sponsors, including all of the previously mentioned. I got it off of Thomas.loc. So they must buy into this bill they cosponsored it. <br /><br />Christopher, strange you refer to empire building. Its already a territory. Seems like the empire was already built.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-11633191074993629602010-04-29T14:03:23.301-04:002010-04-29T14:03:23.301-04:00Wow, you can't win with Joe. Go along with the...Wow, you can't win with Joe. Go along with the party line (according to him, I'm not buying that those Reps are for this) and you are an ideologue. Have an opinion of your own, different from others and you're, what Joe, crazy? Joe, what is YOUR position on this, you are always about picking apart other opinions but you rarely offer your own. Step up to the plate Joe and lay down a single or something. But at least get off the bench. I'm still waiting to hear your suggestions for stopping the influx of illegal immigrants, or what AZ can do to battle it when the Federal Government doesn't do its job.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-57815433086047080132010-04-29T13:58:53.146-04:002010-04-29T13:58:53.146-04:00Also Bruce..... Tuesday
P2+ Total Day
FNC – 1,143...Also Bruce..... Tuesday<br /><br />P2+ Total Day<br />FNC – 1,143,000 viewers<br />CNN – 404,000 viewers<br />MSNBC – 404,000 viewers<br />CNBC – 322,000 viewers<br />HLN – 303,000 viewers<br /><br />P2+ Prime Time<br />FNC – 2,011,000 viewers <br />CNN – 652,000 viewers<br />MSNBC –844,000 viewers<br />CNBC – 274,000 viewers<br />HLN –605,000 viewersAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07899335615984185508noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-58266449048263833882010-04-29T13:58:38.202-04:002010-04-29T13:58:38.202-04:00No Joe, I corrected your question.No Joe, I corrected your question.Christopher - Conservative Perspectivehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14102651466203156040noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-62026654107527039312010-04-29T13:57:26.178-04:002010-04-29T13:57:26.178-04:00Joe politics as usual. Not Democrats as usual. Bot...Joe politics as usual. Not Democrats as usual. Both parties play politics. But this does serve the Democratic party when it comes to gaining a voting bolg of about 4 million. The Dems also want to make it legal for Ex cons to be able to vote as well as all the illegals if they get amnisty. This is all about getting votes. Right now both the Democrats and Republicans are fighting for the latino vote. If the Democrats can get the latino vote like they got the black vote they will own Washington for decades. If the Republicans get the latino vote like the Democrats have the black vote then the Republicans will be pushing for amnisty and Puerto Rico as a state. But Puerto Ricans don't want this as they are happy with having all our protection without paying the taxes.Chrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12905362327313044045noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7705675907060089073.post-75979185867280552682010-04-29T13:52:21.496-04:002010-04-29T13:52:21.496-04:00Hey Bruce, thanks for posting the link to the Nels...Hey Bruce, thanks for posting the link to the Nelson chart. Did you and MM see that viewership peaked at the same time as the healthcare law was being voted on in the House.<br />Seems like more people turned in to get straight answers from Fox on the Healthcare heist than any other station out there.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07899335615984185508noreply@blogger.com