I've posted about unions hiring non-union workers to work the polls in my area. They paid minimum wage without benefits to these laborers. It seems that the unions don't have to follow their own rules. Can anyone tell me why it's OK for the unions to not follow their own 'rules'?
The union could not explain it satisfactorily that is or logically for that matter, so how could anyone else?
ReplyDeleteI am sure JoeC will give a shot though.
I'd also like to know what JoeC thinks. He's one sharp guy if you ask me. Why do you all bash the unions? What have they done to you?
ReplyDeleteGuys the video doesn't show up for me and I'm having trouble finding a legitimate link for the story. Once i find that i'll comment.
ReplyDeleteFound a link. Watched the show.
ReplyDeleteHe has a point. Its completely wrong for unions to hire protesters. It should be union members protesting. I don't know that unions financial situation and what minimum wages are where they've contracted Temp services so i won't comment on that end of things.
That brings an interesting thought to mind. Are there any unionized temp services? I don't know.
And Chris its pretty hard to give benefits to short term temp employees. What do you get for one or two days work? Does a week get you one doctor visit? I think the current UAW-Ford contract is one year for Medical and 5 years to be vested for your pension. So what benefits should they get?
I know that all UAW international full time/part-time employees are members of their respective unions.
If they choose to hire temps they should be receiving adequate wages. Minimum wage is not that.
So now that we have established that unions have flaws, can we get on with things? Unions aren't perfect and neither are any of us. But given where we were before them and where we will be if they no longer exist i prefer to have them.
Chris, CP if you wish to take pro-company stance on unions then you'd have to accept that they are riddled with hypocrisy also. Does that make unions better or worse? No but it shows your stance to be nothing more than politics rather than reality.
ReplyDeleteAre there Crooks in unions? Yes.
Are there hypocrites in unions? yes
Do we disbanded them? No
We don't pull companies charters because their crooks. We don't dissolve all of them because some have admittedly cheated, and knowingly harmed their workers to make a buck.
As a lefty union member i don't walk around all day demanding we shut down all corps because they have crooks and engage in illicit behavior. I don't write blogs about it.
No i understand their purpose and with unions and regulation their illicit actions are curbed. Not stopped but curbed. If companies were perfect than unions and government regulation wouldn't exist.
Umm JoeC, Please point out where I said anything about a company? I know you libs like to confuse issues, deflect and put word's into peoples mouths but this is hard to do on a blog unless Bonsai deletes my word's.
ReplyDeleteAs anyone with eyes can clearly see I only addressed the union. The hypocrisy of the union displayed was also just as clear hence my comment on them and them alone.
Stick with the issue at hand please.
CP, i didn't deflect. Read my posts
ReplyDeletepost one
1. Unions paying minimum wage wrong
2. Unions hiring protesters wrong
3. Impossible to pay benefits to short term temps
4. Unions flawed like all things
Post
1. Establish unions flaws
2. Compare unions flaw to companies
3. Establish that both have flaws, but most liberals don't advocate eliminating Companies vs. Conservatives wishing to break unions. Use myself as example of far lefty.
Because i include you in comments doesn't mean i am doing anything but addressing my feelings to you. It doesn't have to mean i am responding to your particular post.
Joe that isn't just a union flaw. It goes against everything the unions stand for, or used to stand for. The union is nothing like what it used to be. The unions used to be for the members. Now they are turning into a beast that put's it's own interests above all interests. It's a shame you refuse to see what the union has become.
ReplyDeleteChris, thanks for the information.
ReplyDeleteI'm pretty sure i know what the union is for and where its gone wrong. I don't need your help, especially from the man who never blogs criticism of conservatives.
Talk about not seeing what things have become.
JoeC said...@ 06 January, 2011 19:52
ReplyDelete"Chris, CP if you wish to take pro-company stance on unions",,,
Try as you might to deny Joe, but those are your words on this post on this blog on that day and hour.
Now I dare you to quote me on this post where I speak of ANY company position. Good luck.
Stick to the issue at hand.
Joe I have critisized RINO's when they do wrong. It is you that never admits to the left-wing wrongs. You Joe always try and spin the wrongs the left does.
ReplyDeleteJoe why is it the union leaders always talk about creating jobs when they've never created a job in their life? Why is it the union leaders try and destroy the companies that create the last remaining jobs in this country? Why is it that most companies that have been unionized are gone under,gone overseas or have no future in this country?
ReplyDeleteChris, you criticize RINO's. See you don't actually criticize fellow conservatives but only the ones that aren't really conservative.
ReplyDeleteThanks for making my point. And exposing a stupid fallacy on the part of conservatives.
Whens the last time you criticized a GOP member without trying to act like he wasn't really a conservative? Whens the last time you admitted, yeah we got some flaws without trying to act like he wasn't on your side.
And about your flat out lies...How do we stop them?
ReplyDeleteChris said..." It is you that never admits to the left-wing wrongs. You Joe always try and spin the wrongs the left does.
1. Read my posts in this thread.
talking about the video...
JoeC said..."He has a point. Its completely wrong for unions to hire protesters. It should be union members protesting.......
Referring to UAW hiring temp workers
JoeC said...If they choose to hire temps they should be receiving adequate wages. Minimum wage is not that. 06 January, 2011 19:41
JoeC said...
Are there Crooks in unions? Yes.
Are there hypocrites in unions? yes
Do we disbanded them? No
06 January, 2011 19:52
JoeC said...
post one
1. Unions paying minimum wage wrong
2. Unions hiring protesters wrong
3. Impossible to pay benefits to short term temps
4. Unions flawed like all things
Post two
1. Establish unions flaws
07 January, 2011 08:01
How many times must i criticize or agree that unions can be wrong before you can see that i admit to the left-wings flaws?
Notice i didn't duck it or hide behind "their not real union members" or some funny little acronym like how you do.
I mean i could just play your game and call them.
NRU Not Real Unions
Because your post was about some podunk little union i don't belong to..
Chris, as for your last post, i don't know that i can answer histrionics but I'll try.
ReplyDeleteActually I'm not going to try, because those aren't really questions. They are merely statements of your beliefs in disguise.
Really nice try though. almost had me.... :)
JoeC, Why did you not respond to my last comment?
ReplyDeleteAre you that insecure of your own words?
Come on Joe I know you can answer them. Or maybe Vince from the uaw can. Joe why is it the union leaders always talk about creating jobs when they've never created a job in their life? Why is it the union leaders try and destroy the companies that create the last remaining jobs in this country? Why is it that most companies that have been unionized are gone under,gone overseas or have no future in this country?
ReplyDeleteThink that’s shocking? Just wait til taxpayers finally start paying attention to the power public employees have over local, state, and federal budgets. California Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger and former San Francisco mayor Willie Brown have already warned that 80 cents of every state dollar goes to public employee pay and benefits. Other states face similar figures. Shocking figures have shown public employee pensions twice as high in New York compared to their private-sector counterparts. Heck, even 60 Minutes is starting to take notice.
ReplyDeleteWith all the political payoffs, scandals, and bailouts, the issue seems as mundane as the figures are mind-boggling, but the bill for lavish public employee pay is coming due in the form of a pension tsunami — or, if you prefer, a blizzard that will have union bosses calling for a bailout.
All told, billions of dollars have been promised and in many cases are constitutionally guaranteed to retirees. But not all of those promises are realistic, and yet union bosses continue to push for higher pay and more benefits. It’s as if they forget that their members are Americans, too. The decisions are going to be difficult — especially for politicians who were elected by public employee union bosses who are the nation’s heaviest political hitters.
It doesn’t take a weatherman to see the coming blizzard. But it will take political courage — seemingly in such short supply — to start digging out of this mess. This is one of the key fights of 2011 and 2012, so keep your eye on it.
Cp, i', not arguing a semantical point with you. I referenced you, not just on the basis of this post but the others we've discussed together also.
ReplyDeleteIf you think that was incorrect or that you don't have a pro-company bias then i apologize.
CP, you still unwilling to work with UAW veterans committees to help veterans out of dislike for union members? Even the conservative ones?
ReplyDeleteChris, because they aren't questions. You not looking for an answer. Your not really that stupid are you. lets look at what you wrote...
ReplyDeleteChris said...
why is it the union leaders always talk about creating jobs when they've never created a job in their life?
Why is it the union leaders try and destroy the companies that create the last remaining jobs in this country?
Why is it that most companies that have been unionized are gone under,gone overseas or have no future in this country?
What do all three of these have in common? They are statements of Chris's beliefs not questions. Its merely argumentative garbage designed to occupy another's time and result in Me said/ she said back and forth between Chris and I.
Now if you want a debate about your ideas on unions bring some evidence, not just wild eyed statements. Then I can answer them.
Joe they are not beliefs but facts that you choose not to look at. It has been laid out in this blog and in the news for some time now. In fact most of the time it's in video and in their own words. That makes it had to denigh. Nice try though Joe.
ReplyDeleteDear Chris,
ReplyDeleteI'm sure you heard about the massive snow storm that blanketed New York shortly after Christmas.
But what you may not be aware of is that news sources report that sanitation union bosses ordered a "Blue Flu" work slowdown to prevent snow removal in order to protest city budget cuts and layoffs.
We know of this plot because guilt-ridden sanitation workers reportedly confessed the scheme to City Councilman Dan Halloran.
According to Councilman Halloran, "They were told ... to take off routes [and] not do the plowing of some of the major arteries in a timely manner. They were told to make the mayor pay for the layoffs, the reductions in rank for the supervisors, shrinking the rolls of the rank-and-file."
To the union kingpins, throwing a temper tantrum to "make the mayor pay" was more important than rescuing taxpayers, who pay their salaries and benefits, from this winter nightmare.
The city that never sleeps was ground to a halt as residents were trapped like rats in their homes for days due to mountains of snow blanketing their neighborhoods.
In fact, two people, including a newborn baby, reportedly died because ambulances could not navigate unplowed streets in order to save their lives.
The situation was so dire that the U.S. Attorney's office in Brooklyn is opening up a criminal investigation into the allegations of misconduct by unionized sanitation workers' willful neglecting of their basic duty to respond in times of crisis.
The catastrophe in New York highlights the danger of granting monopoly bargaining rights to first responders as Big Labor's Police-Firefighter Monopoly Bargaining Bill is designed to do.
Herding critical government workers under the thumb of Big Labor grants union bosses the power to transform them from public servants to public extortionists, who can hold municipalities hostage to their demands or else they will plunge cities into life-threatening chaos during emergencies.
You and I may have won a round in the last Congress by killing the Police-Firefighter Monopoly Bargaining Bill and Card Check Forced Unionism Bill, but Big Labor has not retreated from the field of battle.
Big Labor still possesses a war chest stocked with tens of billions of dollars of forced union dues to shower on the new congress in order to pry votes to pass their pro-forced unionism agenda.
If any of the reports of union-boss misconduct are proven true this will serve as a stark reminder of the consequences of key government workers falling under the yoke of Big Labor.